Holy Shit!! With Nate & Esha
A beginners guide to spiritual awakening, the metaphysical, unconditional love and all things "whoo whoo". Told from the perspective an average dude and a majestic shaman. ;)
Holy Shit!! With Nate & Esha
Episode 10 - Post Awakening Relationships
In this episode Nate & Esha discuss relationships! Relationships with partners, friends, and most importantly yourself. How do relationships change, improve or end as we awaken and realize who we really are?
Hey guys, welcome to episode 10 of the Holy Shit with Nate and Esha podcast. Uh it's hard to believe we've already got 10 of these now, Esha.
SPEAKER_02:Damn.
SPEAKER_01:That went quick. It went quick. It's I know we're we've kind of been sporadic every we've done a couple, you know, back-to-back weeks, then we miss a couple weeks, whatever. But uh since January now, we've been doing, we've been at this, you know, we're at about five and five months. So um we're turning at about two a month, it looks like. So I mean, I just it seems like um we were starting this yesterday. So 10 uh episode 10. Today we're gonna talk about um relationships. Um, and you know, whether it be you know spiritual relationships or personal relationships, romantic relationships, whatever that is, and how and how an awakening or your spiritual uh journey can affect those. So um, Esha, what's going on?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I am doing good. I am just enjoying this warmer weather, enjoying uh creating. I'm like in creative mode lately. Like there seems to be this shift that's happening inside of me where I'm just opening myself up to collaborating with other like-minded souls or wanting to create a better society for humanity. And that's exciting me so much. Um, so I'm allowing my creative juices to flow and to open up and to say yes to experiences that feel really, really good for me. So I find myself that in spring, this is the season I'm in, and I'm I'm totally stoked about it. Yeah, and stoked about this conversation that we are gonna have today because I think it is so needed and it's where it's such a a precipice in our humanity where um this new idea of relating to each other in relationships and and and how we can create a shift. Because I'm not sure if you heard or if you read it, but and I I thought this was right on time, right? It's like the Surgeon General came out with a report last week that there's an epidemic of loneliness happening in this country.
SPEAKER_01:I know I didn't I didn't read that, but I'm not surprised to hear it.
SPEAKER_02:Right. And so that tells me that it's not just for people who are single, because if you think, oh, I'm lonely, well, maybe you're single. No, people who are married and in relationships can still be lonely.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, I think that I think that those people that are lonely but also married are probably even lonelier because they they have an expectation to be not lonely.
SPEAKER_02:Right, exactly. Exactly.
SPEAKER_01:You know, so I mean if you're if you are alone and lonely, like duh, that's just kind of that might be an expectation. But if you're married and alone, it's make seems to make it worse.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no, 100%. So, you know, I I I'm excited to talk about uh relationships in this episode of our podcast because you know, part of what you and I are doing here, we're serving humanity, the collective, and hopefully some of the things that uh we discuss in our podcast can help shed a light for someone who could maybe, you know, do some, take some action, implement something different in their lives, and just for people to know that they're not alone, right? Yeah, and and how they can maybe find uh community because I think this more than now more than ever, like community is needed, connection, like people are are starving for connection.
SPEAKER_01:You know, I I had lunch with a friend of mine a couple weeks ago, and um it's funny because I I met this guy um through the business world, and we we've known each other for a couple of years, and neither one of us had ever kind of had a conversation at all about spirituality or any of this stuff. And um we he connected with me uh and said, Hey man, I've listened to your podcast. I it's it's I I love it, and I've been going through something similar, you know, about you know, kind of like the very first episode that we did talked about how our introduction, he was like, Let's get together and chat. And it was it was such a refreshing discussion, you know, definitely, and it's also like type A male personality and type a male personality having a conversation about spirituality and connection, and uh you know, all ego was just cast aside, and we sit there and had this amazing, beautiful discussion about how we both are just over like the chase for material things, and and what it what it came back to was that we both admitted in this conversation that like it would be so awesome if we could just like take a torch to it all and like burn it all down, burn it down, burn it all down, and and you know, and literally like live in like a tribe or a community of people, them all like-minded individuals. And I got to thinking about this and to kind of to kind of tie this back around to your loneliness epidemic, this is the reason that this happens, is because humans are communal beings. We are meant to live in tribes and communities of people, yes, and me feed off of your energy and skill set, and your and and then I can also bring something to the table that benefits you. And the problem is that when we don't have anybody to hold up because of what we bring to the table, our own self-identity becomes becomes quite in question. And now we're sitting around looking saying, somebody validate me, somebody validate me, you know, right? And um, and you know, a lot of times that's what relationships become. They're not they're not relationships because you're really there to fill the other person up, you're there because of what that person can how they make you feel. That's right. And um, and that that that over the course of the last 200 years or longer, it's probably the more like the last 500 years, I guess, but I'm I'm I'm using like almost Native American culture in my in my brain because I think that they they had it down right. Everybody had everybody had a skill set, everybody contributed, and and and it was also no, there was no lack of understanding about how you impacted the people of the tribe. You just walk around and look and say, Well, I I made that basket and there's three families carrying corn in, or I killed that I killed that deer last week, and the entire tribe is eating because of it, or whatever. And you know, and it's not necessarily about the I I I, but you understand how the I fits into the tribe.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Yeah, everyone had a communal role that was serving the collective, that was serving that tribe. And and I think I I I do think that this is where we're we're going to eventually come back to because we have to for the sustainability of the human species.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I I I think it's the only it's the only way for it it to happen because if we come back to if if we are involving and ascending in consciousness to the level that I hope and think that we are, it's an inevitability. That's right. Because because every everything else that we that we're standing on right now, the materialism and the individualism, it's all bullshit.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. And it's and it's rocky, right? Like it's it's beginning to crumble. And so it's no longer a stable foundation for the human species to hold itself on.
SPEAKER_01:It is, and and and and when quite frankly, when enough people wake up and start having the conversation that me and my my buddy were having, we will burn it to the ground. We will all and and then and the way that we burn it to the ground, not literally, um, is we stop participating in this this game that you know, I gotta get up and I gotta go work 50 hours a week, I gotta pay this bill and I gotta pay that bill, and I'm gonna pay four dollars of gas. And you know, there's people pulling tricks and stuff with the stock market and all of the other noise, the heavy stuff that's going on. We we we perpetuate it because we participate and we allow it to happen. Yeah, so when I say burn it to the ground, whenever everybody else just wakes up and says, nope, I'm done. I'm not gonna go to work today, and I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna buy gas for two months, um, and I'm not gonna turn on the television, and I'm you know, and you know, all of these things, it's gonna it's gonna Yeah, and it's happening already, right?
SPEAKER_02:It's happening, I mean yeah. I have a young lady who is, you know, helping me, assisting me, and she just quit her job. She's like, I I just can't, I can't live like that anymore. She's like, it doesn't feed my soul, it doesn't nourish me, and I can't continue to live my life like that. And she's like, What we're doing here, what we're creating here, this is so nourishing for me to know that I'm assisting you and that you're assisting me in my own growth and teaching me. She's like, this is what I enjoy more than doing what I did. And so I think we're finding people who are waking up to that already, and it's very exciting, right? Because it is it is gonna get burned down because the human, the human species simply cannot, and we are evolving, and because we are evolving, it the system has to change to reference.
SPEAKER_01:If you think about it, if you think about the the evolution of let's say the last a thousand years, it's the evolution of the ego, and that is that's what's causing it's the me, me, me, and how do I protect me, and how do I set myself apart and all this other stuff. And really the the de-escalation of that is coming back into the oneness of everybody and understanding that we are all the same, we are all all one, and and that yeah, it's okay to have some individuality, but at the same time, we're all the same, you know, it's all it's all it's all one.
SPEAKER_02:Um but you know, and it's also to uh express and give gratitude for the individuality because even within those Native American tribes, right, everyone had their gifts, exactly all the gifts were being utilized, and it was it was perfection and it allowed the whole system to work actually quite cohesive and it was sustainable, right? There was no one who was left out. And what I missed from from cultures like that and relationships like that was especially times during when there was loss when someone died or when someone was being when uh a baby was being born in, everybody participated in that and holding space for that experience, that new experience um that was coming and holding someone in grief, holding and a new mother and and and then raising that child, right?
SPEAKER_01:It's and you know what else too? They participated in it too, not because they were gaslighting or they or because or because they wanted to take a picture of it and post it on social media. Look, look what I did today for my for my friend up the street, and I'm such a great person because I did this. There did it, they did it because it was just the right thing to do. And and and they knew that like it was just an ecosystem, that that's what needed to happen for the the greater good of the tribe.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah, I love that word ecosystem because this is what I feel we're rebuilding with each other, whether we're doing it collectively as a group or whether we're doing it in our own family structures as partners, husband and wife, boyfriend, girlfriend, whatever it is, um, whatever the relationship dynamic we're a part of, mother, son, uh, mother and children. Um doing and this is where it begins in our homes, right? It's like how are we relating to each other in the home? What does the relationship dynamic look like? What are our belief systems in terms of relationship or even uh in terms of roles? How are we showing up? Um, and this is what is changing. Um, and I I want to share just briefly, like anyone who's really interested in this new uh level of partnership, Gary Zukov has a wonderful book that's called Spiritual Partnership, The Journey to Authentic Power. And what he's really talking about in this book is how with as the humans, human beings change and shift and evolve, that it's bringing in a new level of partnership as well in how we relate to each other in relationships.
SPEAKER_00:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Um, and it's it's super, super exciting. So um how so I'm just gonna come off and ask the question to you. You know, you've been through um a huge shift in your life spiritually. How has this shift changed your relationship with your wife?
SPEAKER_01:Or with my wife? Um, it's well, you know, in the very beginning, I think it was it was scary for both of us because there was a shifting away from the norm, which we had grown accustomed to over the course of the previous 10 years of our relationship, you know, and I was starting to show up a little differently than I had previously. And when I say differently, it doesn't necessarily mean bad, it just was different. And, you know, one of the things that I think human beings are scared of the most is change because we don't, it's the unknown. It's like we don't know what's going to happen on the other side. So there was some natural apprehensiveness with her about that. And then of course, you know, I was scared to death too, because I'm like, I'm starting to let go of this facade of who I thought that I was, you know what I mean? And that's also scary as well. So we both kind of like learn how to navigate this, our new relationship together. And what's funny about it is is you know, we have a great marriage, um, but it's not without arguments and discussions and hurdles and all this other stuff. And um what I've found over the last two and a half years or three years since I've been through this awakening is it's it's made me a lot more vocal about what I really, really want. You know, everybody knows everybody knows those discussions in a in a in a marriage, if you married, like those discussions that you can't come back from. Like the the the bell that can't be unrung. Like once once my toe crosses this line, line, that's it. I can't come back from that. Like I if I say if I say this thing, I can't take it back because it's gonna that that if the sound is gonna resonate for throughout the remainder of our race relationship, you know.
SPEAKER_02:Pandora's boxes open.
SPEAKER_01:And and those were discussions that if you really have a healthy relationship with your partner, those are discussions that people don't, they don't, they don't step around. And it's really it's really also it starts with a relationship with yourself, which allows you to have you know be vocal enough to tell talk about what you want and feel worthy of all of that and all of that. So what I'm getting at is like those discussions that I think I had stepped around for a decade, we started, we started to really have. And um it's been listen, it's it's been it's been scary, but at the end of the day, right now where we sit, I think our relationship is stronger than it's ever been because I'm showing up as true and honest and as real as I possibly can. Now, but here's but here's the else, here's the other thing too. And I'm not I'm not saying like, oh, I've done all of this work, I'm great. It's not I'm not what I'm it's not what I'm saying. It's it's an it's a bypop product of this process is that you feel the call to do work on yourself so you can be a better person in general, so you can show up better for your kids, better for your spouse, better, better for yourself. And and I think by doing the work on yourself to figure out who you really are. Most importantly, you start loving yourself. A natural byproduct of that is that a beneficial relationships. Right. Or at least, or at least I should let me let me re let me rephrase that. It benefits it benefits my relationship with my wife. But if we're talking about relationships in general with everybody, it may not benefit that relationship in terms of societal standards to say, oh, well, we're stronger now. It may cause that relationship to just completely be severed, which that's right, it is the best thing for your soul, and it is the best thing for your higher self, and it's it's the best thing for for you to continue your ascension as you're supposed to be doing, because there's a reason. If you're raising your vibration and you're and you're working on yourself and you're moving, you're you're ascending and your your vibration and your energy is changing, those that are not meeting you where that, they're gonna, they're gonna they're gonna fall off. It's just gonna happen. You're gonna become aware of people that you know are not in relationship with you for for your best, the best of both of you guys. Um, you're gonna, you know, and things will start to naturally die away. Um, and um, so anyway, I guess to to kind of put a put a pen in this topic uh for for me is it it's been great. But like I said, it's not it's not been without you know hurdles and discussions and stuff, because you know, let's you know, be honest with you, like it's we both I think the the biggest the biggest thing has been less about like her and me, and it's been more about how what religion the role religion plays in our our relationship now, as opposed to how it used to play. Because when one partner starts to shift their perspective on traditional religion, especially one that that you know, when you when you first got married, you were 100% sure that both of you believed the exact same thing. And all of a sudden, you know, a decade later, one of you starts to shift your perspectives a little bit, um, it it that that could be detrimental to the relationship.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and this and here's where I want to really give kudos to to Keenan, that she which which again it can be a really difficult thing, right? Because like you said, no one likes change, but to remain open to what this new shift is within you, yeah, and to give to give it time, to give it time versus rushing, well, oh my god, you're changing and this is not the person I chose, this is not the person I married, and I want to call it quits, yeah, right. But to to have the fortitude to say, no, I'm gonna wait and see, and I'm gonna be a part of this journey with him. And yes, it might bring up uncomfortableness inside of you because this is different. This is not anything that you know, but to allow yourself to even be challenged a little bit by the uncomfortabless of that and to go in and see why, why is there, why is this not, you know, feeling uh why is it feeling gnarly? Why am I being challenged? Why am I afraid of this changes that's happening within my husband? Yeah, uh, you know, within my spouse. So really I just want to say just kudos to her for being still and being patient with you on the journey, because it's not an easy thing, right? To see someone that you've been with for a long time and to witness this change. And yet the fruits of that change is being um is ripening into your relationship, is it not?
SPEAKER_01:It is, and you know, and you're you're 100% right. Yeah, she's she's been amazing to this, and her ability to kind of just kind of settle in is is has helped me dramatically. But you know, what it is is is in these discussions that we're having, you know, we we've talked about this in past podcasts, is when something like that happens and you like a party in the relationship starts to feel a certain way, and let's just say it's anxious or scared or whatever, like it's very important to like ask, ask why, you know, and um, you know, like what instead of just saying, Well, this makes me feel uncomfortable, like why why do you feel uncomfortable? What what is it? Is it just the change in what we what we got to? She was like, She was like, No, like I see like you're like you're showing up better, you're more you're you're more present. You're you know, you're you're you're I I tell I totally see all that. She says, I'm just scared that you're just gonna take a come home one day, grab a backpack, and go live in the woods and never come back, and that can never come back ever again. You know, she's like, that's what I'm scared of. It's not like I I see everything that you're doing, and I like I I see, you know, everything getting better. She's like, that, but that's what just scares me. And I said, Well, I I totally get it. You know what I mean? Um, I totally get it. So it's been good, but you know, like I said, so it's we've had those tough discussions, and I think it's brought us closer to you know than we've ever been from like um uh a non-spoken connection perspective, like we're more in tune with each other. And what I found ironically is that you know, our spiritual slash religious, whatever you want to call it, beliefs, um, they're not as far apart as I thought they were gonna be as we've started having these discussions, you know. Um, and um so we've kind of we've kind of ripped that band-aid off together a little bit. Um, and of course, I'm very fortunate in a sense that that is the case because um if she had really dug her heels in and been like, no, you're you're wrong, I feel a different way, then that would have obviously been harder to deal with.
SPEAKER_02:Right. But what I love about this is the fact that you both chose, because it is a choice, you both chose to have the difficult conversations, and I think in relationships, people just want to sidestep the uncomfortable conversations, right? And so they just thread so many relationships are just threaded on the superficial, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:No, and I I I've I've been there before, uh yeah, because it's it's safe. You don't want to rock the boat because you, you know, what's gonna happen if I say this or what's gonna happen if I do that, or whatever. And um, and it's it's it's about love and respect, and you don't want to hurt the other person, but at the same time, there's this there's this inner voice, there's this tug of your your soul is telling you, no man, you need to you need to have this discussion, you need to get this thing off your chest. It's been floating around in the ether in this relationship for you know however long, you've got to say this thing. And um, you know, you get to a point, and I think in your awakening and in your relationship with yourself where you realize that anything less than absolute truth is a lie. That's right, and you can't, it's like you can't you can't function that way anymore.
SPEAKER_02:No, and this is when relationships become stale, right? It's like there's no growth, or it's usually one person growing and the other have a perceived sense of not growing, and so the way relations both individuals can grow together in a relationship, right? But it does require relationships require a lot of courage, yeah, right? Because oftentimes we fall in love, right? And I read a book and I don't remember the name of it now, but the the author who was a yogi said, you know, falling in love, do you want to fall into anything? It's like falling into a trap. And so he used the term rise in love versus fallen in love, which I really like that. And so we fall in love, right? We fall in love, and we'll say rise in love for our purposes because we were evolving in our in our language. Um, so we rise in love, but so often in many relationships, people are going into relationships to get something, not to give, right? And the whole idea is how can I become the most wholest version of myself before I enter into a commitment with someone else?
SPEAKER_01:That's the yes, right?
SPEAKER_02:And this is the work that is not being done. We have people who are heavily traumatized, people who are who are fragmented and they're going into relationships, and you've heard the term hurt people, hurt people.
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:And it's not happening from an even from a conscious place. So they don't realize that they're actually hurting someone, but we're taking and slinging this baggage with us into relationships after relationships after relationships. And then we potentially may blame, well, this person is no longer this, this person is no longer that, when the common denominator is you.
SPEAKER_01:100%.
SPEAKER_02:Right.
SPEAKER_01:And so to use a personal example here, I'll I'll just I'll just you know be completely transparent, you know. Um, for for you know, a a theme, a theme of mine and my wife's uh arguments over like the last decade was was she's a very self-assured and self-confident person. She doesn't need any external validation from anybody. Um, I would like to think that I'm that way, but I'm not. Like I heard somebody I heard somebody say um that uh they were like a golden retriever, like that like when they came when their partner came home for the day, they needed they needed them to pat him on the head and tell them that they've been a good boy and give them the hugs and the you know the all of that kind of stuff. And I mean, and that's with with certain people, not everybody, with certain people, um, I'm similar. Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Um, you know, and you know, you've you want to be petted, yeah, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. Show me like validate me, please, right? Yeah, right. You know, and that's you know, that's I'm just this being transparent. I mean, that's and that a lot of us are like that. And uh, you know, I I think there's the the the whole love language thing and all of that. Our ours are completely different things, right? So um anyway, point being is is that I got to this point in our relationship for years where I would in my brain, my ego was telling me, well, there's there's something wrong with her because she I'm asking and I'm asking and I'm asking her to show up in a certain way for me, and she's just not doing it. She just doesn't she doesn't want to do it, you know what I mean? Right. You know, it's one of these things where and if I gotta go ask you to tell me that, you know, to to to show me attention, then then then then it doesn't mean as much, right? Like whatever. Right, right. And uh and so anyway, but but as I've gone through this journey to your point, there's this voice inside of me that's saying, no, no, brother, it's not her. Like you're the one that needs this. That's right. She doesn't need that. Right. You're you're the one that's needing this. You can't you can't show up and be like, I need you, I need you to make me feel a certain way because I'm lacking. Yes, you know what? It's not it's not her job to fulfill my gaps or fulfill, you know, fill my homes.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_01:So, you know, as I've as I've done the work on myself and I'm starting to kind of love myself more and kind of come into that kind of thing, that stuff bothers me a whole lot less because I know she's just being her, she's just showing up as her true authentic self. I'm the one that needs needs something externally, like, you know, and if you've got two people that are in a relationship that both don't need they love themselves and they don't need external validation, that's where it can really start to become a better relationship. And that's that's really what I've seen come in because I I spent years, you know, feeling feeling like, well, I wish, I wish, I wish she would just do this or I wish she would just do that. And really it was, I just needed to be looking in the mirror uh and and be working on myself, you know.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Now I I love that because I I think what that shows is that at some point we have to begin to take responsibility for our emotional health. It's not somebody else's job to be responsible for emotional health. No, and what we want, we're continually wanting to outsource that to that person outside of us. And it's like, wait a minute, well, then if I'm waiting for that person to be responsible to love me, what's my job? What am I doing? Right, right. And so this new way of being, this is you know, call it a sacred partnership is really about going in this interior aspect of ourselves to seeing which part of us is still in need of healing from us. Right. And then that might elicit a lot of different responses, right? And but bringing that to the partner, letting them see you, right? I mean, we're talking about a true relationship where you feel seen, where you can courageously be held in your vulnerability and know that you're not gonna be judged for it. And this is the other part, you know, people have to feel safe in relationships in order to be their full self, their full true self.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And if they're not, if they don't feel safe, then they might not come forward as their true self because they're gonna feel like they're gonna be cut down for it.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:But if the space is created and that other person can mirror this, I see you, I hold you, and I'm with you. And especially I I think for men, right? There are a lot of a lot of my friends are men. And I think men once want to show this aspect, this vulnerable aspect, but they don't want to seem as if they're weak.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And there are a lot of women out there who will look at a man who's vulnerable and say, Oh my God, look at this man. He's He's girlish or you know.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And women need to stop doing that. We need to stop deflating our men.
SPEAKER_01:I I think it's one of the most masculine and and assertive things that you can possibly do to be vulnerable in front of somebody else because it means that you're you you've got some courage.
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely. And you're tapped in to an aspect of you that is deeper than just the superficial, right? Like you're you're connected to your heart. And what woman doesn't want a man that's connected to their heart?
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:I won't take a man unless he's otherwise connected to his heart.
SPEAKER_00:Sure.
SPEAKER_02:And so, you know, in the book, what Gary says is like the old paradigm of relationship was just thinking that we're these five sensory organisms, whereas we're actually multi-sensory organisms, right? And so we're no longer operating on just what I can see, taste, smell, touch. It's now there are other aspects of me that are coming alive. And this is what's happening to people in the awakening process. All these other sensory aspects of us are coming online.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Right.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that's that's um absolutely. Absolutely. It's it's it's almost like you've gotten a you've gotten a new a new set of glasses, uh, and and you can see more things with them.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Well, it's just like what's happening, you know, and I keep likening this to my yoga students, um, and keep reminding them as I'm reminding myself that this template that we have, this body, this heart, our soul, this is the original smart technology. Yeah, and it's finally now coming back online and the way nature intended for it.
SPEAKER_01:Sure.
SPEAKER_02:Right? And so many people are being rewired and upgraded in this way. It's like the old software that we once had that's obsolete now for us. And so, how do we now work with this new technology that we have and how do we apply this in the relationships that we're a part of? And I feel this is where you know, so many people are finding themselves jobs no longer working for them, relationships no no longer working for them. Um, but I think if people can be courageous enough to say, you know what, let me be still with this for a moment. This man, this woman, whoever that I've been with for all of these years, there's something here. What can I learn if I gave myself an opportunity to pause, be a witness, and to deepen into this change? You know, what is it that I'm afraid within myself to change in this way? Yeah. So I think it's such an opportunity for us to just deepen into our own creation of who we could become.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I mean, what's I mean, uh what's been your relationship perspective with your awakening? I mean, I know um it had some initial effects on your marriage originally, and then it kind of helped out a little bit at the end, but I just what's what's what's your perspective?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you know, it's you know, I started going through when I started going through my awakening, I was 33 years old. And I was a few years into my marriage at that point. We got married in 97, and so I was 33 in 2003. Um, but it began it began to deepen and deepen and deepen as the years went on. Um, and I did find myself, I'm like, oh my God, I'm having going through all these changes, and I began to feel deeply inside that I wanted my relationship to move in that same evolution, right? Into that same state. I I started to see that our relationship, there was a higher level to where our relationship could go. I didn't, I no longer wanted, I didn't want to engage in a status quo relationship.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Right. And that was very, uh, very, very strong for me. And and you know, my husband at the time, he was in corporate America and you know, busy work, finances, you know, he was a financial planner, and and um, and for him, you know, I think a lot of it was he didn't really necessarily have the time. Now he was a very deep person, very quiet person. And perhaps he was growing in a different way than I was, sure, that I didn't necessarily take into uh effect. But we finally got to a crossroads in 2016, where I just felt so uncomfortable. And I said, you know what, we're coming up on 20 years of marriage, and I need a I need a pause here. I I need some breathing room. I was like, I'm going through all of these changes, I'm sharing them with you, and I'm also feeling like I'm alone.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And um, and so I I did the boldest, most courageous thing that I've ever done in my entire life, and it scared the shit out of me. Um, but I said, you know what, I'd I'd like to have a separation for a little while. I need to breathe.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And it took me such a long time to even ask for that. Like part of me was like, is this even possible to ask for something like that?
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Um and so we we we separated um in a very conscious way. Um, it it wasn't a separation to say, oh, I want a divorce, or it wasn't a separation to say, oh, I want to be with someone else. It wasn't about that. I think when you've with when you're with someone for a very long time, when you met when you were so young, because he was 21, I was 23, we were babies.
SPEAKER_00:Sure.
SPEAKER_02:And here you are now in your in your 40s. It's you know, it's like you're different people. Who are you becoming? Who do you want to be? And the separation was really hard for him because he's like, Why, why is this happening? So it shook his world. Uh, it shook my world and our children, but I couldn't lie to myself, and and I had to ask for what I felt at the time I needed. And so we spent a year. I mean, he would he got an apartment and we would trade spaces like every other weekend, he'd come and be at the house and spend time at the house with the kids, and I would go to the apartment and stay. So this is how we worked it. So I would have some alone time, and then he would have alone time with the kids, and then he'd have alone time with himself.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And I said, let's see who we who we are, what we want, what's going on. I was like, if we're gonna spend the next 20 years together, I want it to be different.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_02:And sometimes that does require a little a little bit of space, um, even though we were seeing each other still every day, because he would still pick the kids up, drop them off, come home after work, see them. I didn't want anything, any of the routine to change with our children. Um, and so at that year mark, so we came, we come in uh at the year mark, and it's our anniversary. 20 years, and I remember the day so clearly because he came in to pick the kids up to take them to school, and uh he gave me a kiss on the cheek and he said, Happy anniversary, and he just looked at me. And uh later on, this was the time I had my yoga studio, he called me on the phone and he said, you know, well, he first he had flowers delivered to the studio, and then he called and said, Um, he's like, you know, this year has been the hardest thing for me. And um, and he's like, I don't know what else to say. I just love you. My the heart loves what it loves. And he cried on the phone, and it moved me so much because I had seen the shift and change in him over the course of the years, where he also began because I would ask him questions like, What do you want? What is it that you're dreaming about? I was like, I know it's most of your time is for your family and nothing else. I was like, but I want to know what you're dreaming of in your heart, what you want to do as well.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Um, and so we met, I was like, let's let's just go and have a drink. I'm like, it's our 20th anniversary, we should at least celebrate it. And so we we met at a bar and we nursed one drink, because neither of him or I are big drinkers, and we nursed one drink for two hours. But I gotta tell you, Nate, that that time spent with him was just glorious because we laughed, we talked, we were in the present moment. We didn't even bring up anything in the past about the last year, about the separation. It was just two souls meeting right here. Yeah, and then he walked me through the car after, and we just stood there just gazing at each other for like 10 minutes, and then we kissed. And that was the first kiss we'd share in in a year.
SPEAKER_01:Oh wow, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And I said, We both look, we both pulled back and we just said, What's happening? I was like, I don't know, but it's worth worth it for us to continue this investigation. And uh I was like, Look, we've been together for 20 years, 24, the with the four years that we dated before that. And I said, Why don't we start courting each other again? I was like, why don't we do that? I was like, let's not tell anyone, let's not tell the children, because I don't want to give them false hope or anything. I was like, this is just for you and I. And that's exactly what we did. You know, we started going out and you know, we would get dressed up and go uptown, and and he had this apartment thing, which we which became more like our sex place that we would go to and have sex, right? I mean, it was it was amazing. I was like, I was like, we ought to keep this apartment as this as the as the shag pad. I was like, you're moving back in, but let's keep this apartment as a sex shot. I was like, it's awesome. Um and then by April, so that was February, and by April, we did I we did a release and ceremony of all the old. And before, he would never like, you know, I was into doing ceremonies and stuff like that, and it wasn't his thing. Yeah, and this is how much this man had grown. Like I could I came to him, I said, let's do a release and ceremony, put in behind everything that we went through and just come into a new place. And we did that, and then I got down on my knees and I proposed to him. Oh, and I said, Will you marry me? And I told him, but it's not the little girl in me that's asking for your hand, it's the woman in me asking for your hand. I was like, when we met, I was 23, I was a little girl, I didn't know what I wanted. Yeah, I was like, now I'm a woman and this is what I want. And so we had planned to renew our vows in two in 2018. Um, and that never, if any of our listeners know my story, he died in uh a couple months later in August of 2017, unexpectedly. But we had the best six months, the best six months, and I never thought it possible to fall in love so hard again with someone that I've known for 24 years.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. But you know, the the reason that that happened though was because you had those discussions that you can't come back from. That's right. You know, those are the those are the real discussions. That's where like like freedom and like true love and all of like the things that you're wanting in relationships, they lie on the other side of that, yes, of that fear, you know. Yes. Um and bless you if you have a relationship that you're already there, but a lot of us don't don't show the real us or aren't 100% truthful with our partners or even ourselves, really. It's not even it's really not even, you know, and there and what what I'm finding is that it's not a major shift relationship-wise, it's mostly a shift within yourself that causes you to it's really you start to love yourself and you start to see things from a new perspective, and you demand you demand something better for yourself. 100%. And then that that forces these real discussions. And um, I yeah, I I I I thank you for sharing that because that it's a it's a it's a really cool story, and I know it's um it's one that resonates with me, and I know it will with our listeners, and I know it's not easy for you to talk about it, but it's um it's really, really cool.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you know, it's it's I think about it and it brings joy before it would it would make me really sad. Um, what I miss is you know the partnership. Like I think about wow, what what could this partnership have been, right? And yet I'm continuing that level of sacred partnership within my own self because now it's my responsibility to carry that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Until you know, I'm blessed with another partner in that way. But I know I can't accept anything less than what I what that is.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, but I mean, to your point though, I mean, it was 14 years into your awakening, it sounds like, and to the point that you got to the point of where you felt like your partner was moving with you forward.
SPEAKER_02:That's right. It takes it takes a while.
SPEAKER_01:That's a shit ton. That's a that's a very long time. That's so long.
SPEAKER_02:It is, but I gotta tell you, you're working through different things in that time, right? And I I'm not one to just toss a towel in like that, right?
SPEAKER_01:That's my point. I mean, I think a lot of people would have probably given up before 14 years, yeah. No, and and that's just a testament to you, um, because it it is, it can't I I I would imagine that uh the years where you were wanting it to be different and it wasn't was very hard.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, extremely so, especially the you know, like the last couple of years when I was really deepening into my the shamanism, I was called to that and having all of these other experiences that he couldn't absolutely not relate to. And he would say, He's like, I don't know what to say, I don't know how to be. He's like, I don't know. Yeah, and so what I learned in the year apart from myself is how to accept him exactly as where he was and that it was okay.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and that was that was my growth in this area, and for his growth, I wanted him like I'm like, I need more emoting from you. Right. I was like, how are you feeling? As like, you know, and and the year that we were apart, he learned how to communicate more about what he was truly feeling and not being afraid to say it. Yeah, you know, and and it was it was beautiful to be to receive him in his vulnerability because that's really all I was wanting. I was like, I know this other side exists, you know, I'd like to experience that side with you.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Man. Yeah, I mean, um it's it's it's such a it's such an interesting uh, you know, dance with yourself, dance with uh your partners, dance with your friends. I mean, it's just it it's all I mean it's all it's it gives you it gives you such a such a different perspective on everything. And um you've got to be willing, you've gotta be willing to to to have those uncomfortable discussions with everybody to to really allow like the real magic to happen.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I just want to really piggyback for just a small moment on what you said because I think it's so key. We often are not honest with ourselves, yeah, and how we're truly feeling. And until we're honest with ourselves, we're gonna continue to lie to ourselves, yeah, and to the person in that relationship with.
SPEAKER_01:No, this is this is a key, and honestly, this this is a podcast that needs it it's it's it's inevitable, and and we probably should have done it before this one because it it's almost it's almost like the one of the most important things is one of our next podcasts here pretty soon is gonna be self-love um specific, because I I think that that is that is such a major domino in your spiritual awakening process because until that domino falls, like the progress that you're gonna make is gonna be so much slower. Uh, and then once that domino falls, it opens up so much more. Um, so but that's it. I mean, and and it's it goes you, it's it's it's it's an old adage that says, you know, you can't really love somebody until you love yourself. And it it I think that doesn't really mean what it sounds like it means. Right. But but it's true. It's true. It's it's a true statement. Um, but it's it's um it it's it's it's so it's so you know, you it's it's it's it's so valid because you can't not only do you you don't even know really what love is from that perspective, because if you can't love yourself, like you don't even understand, you don't even you don't even all all you're doing is is you're reacting to the way that someone else makes you feel about yourself.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, a hundred percent react and love me so I can love myself. Yeah, that's that's what we're practicing. Love me so I can love myself, and that will never be sustainable. It it we it will always fall short. You're never gonna be satisfied because something would always feel like it's missing, and what's missing is you stepping in and loving yourself because there's absolutely no one that can love you the way you can love yourself. Right, always yeah, yeah, and this is this is our responsibility to ourselves is to really get real, do the work. Do I love me? And what does that even mean? Do I love me unconditionally? Do I love me unconditionally? And just do the work, you know. So to our listeners who are who are you know braving with us throughout this entire episode, is you know, just take a moment and do some self-assessment. Yeah, you know, how do I show up to myself? How am I loving myself? Do I love myself unconditionally? What does what is my definition of love? You know, not the fruity things, you know, oh I get you know gifts received. No, no, no, no, no. It's like when you do something, you know, are you able to love yourself? Are you able to love yourself in a body that you know that you feel isn't your right body? You know, can you love yourself if you make a mistake? Like, can you love? I mean, what what does that look like for you? Because we say we love and we throw that word around quite loosely, too loosely for my taking.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:Um, and we don't really know what love means.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:If we're being honest. I and I I think that this is this is where I also challenge is too, is we get so programmed to react to certain statements. Uh in a way where like there's this there's this this layer, this outer layer of like what it is is that if we get if we get past that layer, you really have to look inward at yourself and it's so uncomfortable. And we get to the point of when we hear statements like what you just said, and we just kind of brush them off and we say, nah, that's not me. I'm good. Right. I'm good. And what really, if you allow, and what well, I think what happens is as you start to awaken, like that that wall starts to crack a little bit, and those things start to get through, and you your ability to say, nah, I'm good, starts to become way less effective. So you start to you start to have to deal with the shit that you know real stuff. Um so I would just I would just challenge you, like, and and maybe maybe you are good, maybe you are perfectly good, but it's okay if you're not. And like 99.9% of the people on this planet are not, and they really probably need to take a look inside. And when we start to do that, I mean the the the things that we can accomplish um as a community, as a as a collective are gonna be amazing.
SPEAKER_02:Amazing, amazing, and you know, for me, it I mean, uh it's been a total transformation for me because I used to be one of those women that would fall in love too quickly. You know, and oh, this person makes me feel so amazing. Oh, I love you, not realizing, wait a minute, is that really love? Yeah, yeah, you know, and uh and so you know I I've had to learn a lot through my own experiences in in relationships and to really come down to what what really is love? Is love a feeling? It's beyond it's beyond feeling. Love has is not that feeling, right? Right. Um so it's it's it's deeper, it's it's sacred. Um and oftentimes we get lust and love confused. We get this person makes buys me this stuff, I must love them. You know, it there's there's so much, and we can keep going on and on um uh uh about what it is and what it isn't. But I want to put out there one last thing here before we wrap up. Get to know who you are at the core. One of the personality tests that helped me significantly when I was doing my spiritual direction training was the Enneagram.
SPEAKER_01:Enneagram, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so they have short tests that you can take online. And so take the Enneagram test, see what personality you come out as. And it's the oldest personality test that that has been around for thousands of years, actually. And it's the one that will really show some authentic, an authentic look, uh, view at who you are. And I'm a two on the Enneagram, which is the giver-pleaser. And once I understood that, I'm like, oh.
SPEAKER_01:So you I I don't that's funny though, because I don't know you as that type of person.
SPEAKER_02:Not anymore. I've had to do the work to transform that into a healthy into a healthy work. So once you find out your personality type and where you land, you then begin to show up a little bit differently to change out of the unhealthy habits of over pleasing and over-giving, just so you can feel loved.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Because that's why you give and over-please is so that you can feel good about yourself.
SPEAKER_01:Right. Exactly.
SPEAKER_00:Right.
SPEAKER_02:So I've had to do my own internal work. And so every time I do something, I'll ask myself, why am I doing this?
SPEAKER_01:Well, and you know what's funny about it is knowing what it knowing what I know about your upbringing in your in your past, it makes total sense about why you would be it, why you would be that way. 100%. So so yeah, I I have taken a whole lot of personality type uh tests. I've not taken the Enneagram, so I'm I'll do that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. I'd be interested to see uh where where you come out of. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Because I I want to I want to talk, well, we'll we're gonna we're gonna have another topic about self-love in general because there's a whole bunch of stuff we can talk about in that. Because I mean, I know this this I know this topic we we talk about relationships, but this is this is relevant because you do have a relationship with yourself. Um, so it is it is relevant, but um, yeah, I'm excited. This this is this I've I've been taking notes throughout the course of this uh podcast, and I've got a I've got a lot of things that like just today's conversation sparked.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I think it'll be awesome. I have uh someone who was a teacher for me um in my spiritual direction program, she actually teaches Enneagram stuff, so it'd be really great for her to come on and kind of go through the nine different personality types so our listeners can actually get an idea of what they represent.
SPEAKER_01:I love that. Let's do it.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Well, cool.
SPEAKER_01:You got anything you want to end on?
SPEAKER_02:No, you know, I'm just just you know, for those of you who are in relationships, um be patient with each other and be compassionate with each other, right? If you can work with those two in your relationship and really see each other, not not just and I'm not just talking about these two eyes, but to see the other person, um, and and to know that you're both souls growing in this grand experiment of being human.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I'm just gonna end with the fact that says that you know, through this process with me and the awakening and the all of the other stuff, is that I I feel like I I've probably, for the first time in my entire life, really do understand what love actually is. And you helped me get a long way through that. So I'm so grateful. And I'm very happy to say that with without 100% hesitation, that I really do love you and I really and I really appreciate you. And um, I'm so excited about what we've got, what we've creating here and um and what we're gonna do next.
SPEAKER_02:And if I may add one last thing, you and I share this, you and I share this beautiful love for each other, and I just want to tell there are people out there who will say, Oh, well, you can't have a relationship with the opposite sex, and I want to say that that is absolutely not true. You can have a sacred friendship with the opposite sex and it's not sexual.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:Right. So, you know, uh, because you and I do share a deep love for each other, and um, and that's just a sacred soul type of love that's that's always going to exist.
SPEAKER_01:Right. Yeah, no, no, no, no doubt about it. We we I think we were both sent here to to aid each other along in this process. And and when you find those people that are that way, your soul tribe, if you will, whatever you call it, there's there's an immediate reverence and love for them because you know that you both are there to serve each other and and and aid along this way. And and that's really what love is, right? It's like it's a it's a it's an uh it's an ability to not focus on how is this benefiting me and how can we how can we make it further as we uh together? That's right.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, it's love and service of transformation.
SPEAKER_01:There you go. Well, I think that that's a perfect note to end on it. So all right, guys, thanks for sticking around for this one. Excited to bring you some more. This is gonna be the end of episode 10. We'll see you later.